David Barton is feeling the criticism from Worldview Weekend founder Brannon Howse. Today, Barton responded to some of those criticisms as he framed them.
Howse is particularly concerned that David Barton’s partnership with Glenn Beck leads Christians to believe that Beck is a Christian or that Mormonism is just a form of Christianity.
Barton’s approach was to call Beck a Christian because Beck says that Jesus is his savior and redeemer and point to Beck’s deeds to validate his faith. You can read essentially what Barton claimed on the air here on his Facebook page.
This post is mostly news with little analysis but I will say that Mormon and Christian theology about Christ is different and Mormons speak very similar words as do Christians when it comes to Christ. It appears that Barton is not aware of this or does not want to explore this in any depth. He seems to have no problem with Mormonism’s use of the Book of Mormon as Scripture and assumes that because Mormons also use the Bible, they are speaking the same confession.
A bit more of an aside: Given the way Barton treats history, I am not surprised that he treats theology in a similar manner.
Barton doesn’t “care what the label is” he is trying to influence policy which makes it fine. In the SevenMountain teaching of taking dominion over the mountains of culture, personal redemption is less important than societal salvation. Even if Beck is a Mormon, it is appropriate for Christians to recommend him and promote him because he is helping the Christians take over the cultural mountains.
Near the end of the program, Barton addresses the charges of dominionism. He dismisses dominionism, the New Apostolic Reformation, and reconstructionism as terms he doesn’t know.
Barton and Green revealed that Howse’s criticisms are having an impact in that Barton’s supporters are calling and writing about them.
Generally, I don’t like to make a big deal out of religious differences when it comes to how you treat people and how we all need to get along despite our differences. Here, however, Barton is again calling on people to obscure obvious distinctions as if they are not real. He does it in history and he is also doing it over these theological differences.
21 thoughts on “David Barton again defends Glenn Beck as a Christian”
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Frank# ~ Sep 13, 2011 at 8:00 pm
“isn’t this like having your intellectualism defended by Paris Hilton?”
I liked this. Although if it came to a choice, I’d rather be defended by Paris Hilton 🙂
If Glenn Beck said that he believes that Jesus is his savior, then it’s no different then a Christian saying the same thing. It amazes me that Christians don’t like when people who are Mormon, say things that a Christian says and then they say that the other one “poisons” it. You people are so funny saying the grass isn’t greener on the other side and then saying something completely different when you feel like it.
Technically, Mormons are not Christians, because they do not accept the Doctrine of the Most Holy Trinity as laid down by the councils of the Church. I have no problem with ‘people of good will’ who are not technically Christians, but would stop short of saying that they were Christians.
This ‘Jesus is my (personal) Saviour’ thing raises my hackles; it all sounds so ‘me me me’. Perhaps it shouldn’t … but it does. So there we are.
Just to clarify … I meant “perhaps it shouldn’t raise my hackles.”
My understanding of the term christian means a person who believes in the divinity and follows the teachings of Jesus Christ. Under that definition Mormons are indeed christians, however, Thomas Jefferson was not (since he didn’t believe in the divinity).
Hmmm.
My understanding is that the Mormon belief doesn’t match with the credal statement that says that Jesus is “consubstantial with the Father”. This is a required ‘belief’ for orthodox Christians. (Many Christians actually don’t [fully] embrace this belief either: for example, they might say that, when Jesus was on the Cross, he was ‘not God’. The Nicene Creed indicates otherwise.)
I would characterize the Mormon concept of the Trinity as being something like God the Father being ‘the Boss’, with the ‘Son of God’ and the ‘Holy Spirit’ as ‘servants of the Father’. The Christian concept is that the Three Persons of the Most Holy Trinity are “equal in majesty and undivided in splendour’, and – absolutely – ONE God. Does that make any sense?
But these ‘technical niceties’ are probably completely unimportant compared with being a ‘person of good will’. 🙂
If Glenn Beck said that he believes that Jesus is his savior, then it’s no different then a Christian saying the same thing. It amazes me that Christians don’t like when people who are Mormon, say things that a Christian says and then they say that the other one “poisons” it. You people are so funny saying the grass isn’t greener on the other side and then saying something completely different when you feel like it.
Technically, Mormons are not Christians, because they do not accept the Doctrine of the Most Holy Trinity as laid down by the councils of the Church. I have no problem with ‘people of good will’ who are not technically Christians, but would stop short of saying that they were Christians.
This ‘Jesus is my (personal) Saviour’ thing raises my hackles; it all sounds so ‘me me me’. Perhaps it shouldn’t … but it does. So there we are.
Just to clarify … I meant “perhaps it shouldn’t raise my hackles.”
My understanding of the term christian means a person who believes in the divinity and follows the teachings of Jesus Christ. Under that definition Mormons are indeed christians, however, Thomas Jefferson was not (since he didn’t believe in the divinity).
Hmmm.
My understanding is that the Mormon belief doesn’t match with the credal statement that says that Jesus is “consubstantial with the Father”. This is a required ‘belief’ for orthodox Christians. (Many Christians actually don’t [fully] embrace this belief either: for example, they might say that, when Jesus was on the Cross, he was ‘not God’. The Nicene Creed indicates otherwise.)
I would characterize the Mormon concept of the Trinity as being something like God the Father being ‘the Boss’, with the ‘Son of God’ and the ‘Holy Spirit’ as ‘servants of the Father’. The Christian concept is that the Three Persons of the Most Holy Trinity are “equal in majesty and undivided in splendour’, and – absolutely – ONE God. Does that make any sense?
But these ‘technical niceties’ are probably completely unimportant compared with being a ‘person of good will’. 🙂
I’ve taken ‘expert advice’ on this matter from a couple of high-powered theologians. The principal (theology) heresy of Mormonism is indeed ‘Subordinationism’ (the idea that ‘the Son of God’ and ‘the Holy Spirit’ are in nature / essence subordinate to ‘God the Father’); Christian orthodoxy states (and here is the formula presented in the Mass on the Solemnity of the Most Holy Trinity):
“It is truly right and just, our duty and our salvation,
always and everywhere to give you thanks,
Lord, holy Father, almighty and eternal God.
For with your Only Begotten Son and the Holy Spirit
you are one God, one Lord:
not in the unity of a single person,
but in a Trinity of one substance.
For what you have revealed to us of your glory
we believe equally of your Son
and of the Holy Spirit,
so that, in the confessing of the true and eternal Godhead,
you might be adored in what is proper to each Person,
their unity in substance,
and their equality in majesty.”
Christians support Jews and they’re not Christians in general. Consider as Jesus did, where’s the fruit? Glen preaches faith, love & charity mixed with patriotism better than most charismatic preachers
Christians support Jews and they’re not Christians in general. Consider as Jesus did, where’s the fruit? Glen preaches faith, love & charity mixed with patriotism better than most charismatic preachers
Who does David Barton and Glenn Beck fear the most? Roger Williams and John Leland. Why do they fear these men? Because they founded the Baptist Faith in American and were staunch proponents of the separation of church and state. Any time these to founding fathers are introduced to a discussion, the post is deleted and poster banned. Something to think about.
Who does David Barton and Glenn Beck fear the most? Roger Williams and John Leland. Why do they fear these men? Because they founded the Baptist Faith in American and were staunch proponents of the separation of church and state. Any time these to founding fathers are introduced to a discussion, the post is deleted and poster banned. Something to think about.
Recommended reading : If this goes on…
Recommended reading : If this goes on…
Frank# ~ Sep 13, 2011 at 8:00 pm
“isn’t this like having your intellectualism defended by Paris Hilton?”
I liked this. Although if it came to a choice, I’d rather be defended by Paris Hilton 🙂
isn’t this like having your intellectualism defended by Paris Hilton?
isn’t this like having your intellectualism defended by Paris Hilton?