And you seem to completely ignore the fact that in tolerant societies, several other minority groups ALSO have problems that the larger society/culture does not share

Hm, that makes me think. If I come to the conclusion that identity may actually play a part in many gay men’s feelings of alienation or whatever makes them feel social anxiety in a most liberal society, does that make me a neighbour to Narth and anti-gay people? Maybe it’s possible that I can think of a slightly negative conclusion, without having any other intention. It’s not like research should only paint a rosy picture of any given identity (even heterosexual). We still don’t know what Sanders will find with that gay genes study.

No Evan, that’s not it. What makes me think you have ulterior motives is that despite the study’s authors offering other explanations for their results, despite the fact that there are several other logical explanations for the results you offer, you seem to latch onto the few that are only touted by other anti-gay folks. It makes me question your intentions.

So someone could actually argue that identification does not improve well-being, at least that’s what’s coming from the statistical data

I don’t see how you are claiming this – the 2.6 times more mood disorders than the general population is the looking at the whole sample set of MSM (both those that identify as gay/queer/homosexual and those that don’t).

When you look at the rate of distress and depression – broken down by those are qay-etc identified versus those who are not the rates are higher for those not identified as such.

And yes correlation does imply causality – but correlation is necessary (though not sufficient for causality) – this study would seem to indicate that you cannot even show the necessary requirement to support your hypothesis.

Actually the odds ratio of having mood disorders is almost the same for MSM as that in the smaller sample Dutch study and 2.7 larger than that of the general population of men. That actually proves the rate remains the same even if one country does permit marriage and adoption and all the other rights as the rest of the population. So someone could actually argue that identification does not improve well-being, at least that’s what’s coming from the statistical data. They say: ‘Multivariate analysis can establish association, not causality.’ and then they explain that they specifically included those possible reasons for causing distress to see whether any future interventions can address these mental health problems. Apparently, checked against the Dutch study, the odds seem to be independent of those variables; they are the same.

It seems to run counter to your ideas about identity.

Hm, that makes me think. If I come to the conclusion that identity may actually play a part in many gay men’s feelings of alienation or whatever makes them feel social anxiety in a most liberal society, does that make me a neighbour to Narth and anti-gay people? Maybe it’s possible that I can think of a slightly negative conclusion, without having any other intention. It’s not like research should only paint a rosy picture of any given identity (even heterosexual). We still don’t know what Sanders will find with that gay genes study.

I don’t think anyone disputes the conclusions of this (and other) studies that show gays and lesbian have more mental health problems as compared to heterosexuals. The reason for these differences and what one can conclude from these differences – is where the disagreement is.

BTW, Sandfort cannot be suspected of doing research to support some ex-gay people’s agenda. He chaired a lesbian and gay studies section in a Dutch faculty.